Missing files? Anyone have this working?

[hdtodd]

I was very happy to see this 1022 repository -- I thought 1022 was the best database system I'd ever used because of its easy-to-use command language.

So I've cloned it from this repository and FTP'd it to one of my DEC20 installations, and I started working through the manual to figure out how to install it.

But at the outset, it appears that there are some files missing, most notably 1022NS.EXE and Q*.EXE (I haven't checked for all).

It also appears that there is a version skew between the TOPS-20 version this was released for (6.1) and the version I'm running from Panda (7.1). So it's not clear that the patching of PA1050 will even work, after I find the DEC PAT utility distribution.

I was hoping to get 1022 installed and running, then create a DUMPER tape so that others could just install from that tape onto Panda distributions and have a running system. But it's not clear that I can get there from here.

Has anyone gotten 1022 running by cloning this repository?

[larsbrinkhoff]

These are random best-effort files I grabbed out of Tymshare tapes. As far as I know they have not been tested in any way, but I'm very glad now someone is trying! I think you're the first, so it's uncharted territory.

[larsbrinkhoff]

I searched for 1022NS, but I got no hits: https://github.com/search?q=org%3ATYMCOM-X%201022NS&type=code

Feel free to rummage around in there!

[larsbrinkhoff]

Files beginning with Q https://github.com/search?q=org%3ATYMCOM-X+path%3A**%2Fq*&type=code
No Q*.EXE that I can see.

[hdtodd]

Thanks, Lars!  Yes, I was revisiting the repository last night and saw the source link.  It looks like the files are there!  I'll go through the installation guide and pull out the missing files and give it another try.  I'll submit a pull request when I've collected them all, and again if I get my system configured and operating to the point where I can generate a DUMPER tape for others to use. THANKS SO MUCH for having found these in the first place.  Really valuable work! David

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On 12/12/25 5:41 AM, Lars Brinkhoff wrote: *larsbrinkhoff* left a comment (PDP-10/System1022#1) <#1 (comment)> These are random best-effort files I grabbed out of Tymshare tapes. As far as I know they have not been tested in any way, but I'm very glad now someone is trying! I think you're the first, so it's uncharted territory. — Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub <#1 (comment)>, or unsubscribe <https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/ABJWBXDMIZW53WGPNUEPNYD4BKLXBAVCNFSM6AAAAACOY6SDFWVHI2DSMVQWIX3LMV43OSLTON2WKQ3PNVWWK3TUHMZTMNBVHEZTOOBRGE>. You are receiving this because you authored the thread.Message ID: ***@***.***>

[larsbrinkhoff]

Thanks for looking into it!

Credits for finding the tapes should not go to me, but to an anonymous donor. I don't know the full story of how they ended up here, and perhaps it's best that way. The official story is that they "fell of the truck".

[hdtodd]

Looks like the missing files are in 169275.tape/forotsqa. . Even if all the files are there, it looks like I'll need to apply the PA1050 patches to get 1022 running.  And even then, I'm concerned about the version skew -- 1022 for TOPS-20 6.1 while I'm running 7.1. It'll be a while before I can work through all that, but again, thanks!   I'll report back as I make progress.

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On 12/12/25 8:23 AM, Lars Brinkhoff wrote: *larsbrinkhoff* left a comment (PDP-10/System1022#1) <#1 (comment)> Thanks for looking into it! Credits for finding the tapes should not go to me, but to an anonymous donor. I don't know the full story of how they ended up here, and perhaps it's best that way. — Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub <#1 (comment)>, or unsubscribe <https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/ABJWBXD27QC6LI2T2EODIE34BK6VLAVCNFSM6AAAAACOY6SDFWVHI2DSMVQWIX3LMV43OSLTON2WKQ3PNVWWK3TUHMZTMNBWGQ3TCNZVGI>. You are receiving this because you authored the thread.Message ID: ***@***.***>

[hdtodd]

Lars,

I have reliably working DEC20s on several computers now, with updated FORTRANs that compile my old code and generate extended-addressing code, so I turned my attention back to 1022.

I don't believe that 1022 can be recovered as a working system from the tapes in this repository:

1. The install guide references installing on TOPS-20 "6.1 or later"; Panda is 7.1 (the .1 being MRC's mods, I think). But I think the version on the tapes is really targeted to TOPS-20 6.1.
2. None of the .EXE files on the tapes (including the INSTAL.EXE used for configuring) actually start up; they all issue immediate "?Illegal instruction 0 at 600010" messages when started. Likely due to PA1050 incompatibility with V7.1 of TOPS-20.
3. The PA1050 DEC-10 compatibility package on those tapes is likely not to work with V7.1 TOPS-20 without patching, and the Autopatch updates for PA1050 are likely not going to patch V7.1's PA1050 correctly (I haven't tried yet).
4. While it's not needed for basic 1022 database operations, the FORTRAN host-language interface is for FORTRAN-20 V10; V11 was distributed in 1987, and that's the version installed on Panda. I'd need to install V10 to replace V11 and then install the 1022 FOROTS patches over that V10 version's FOROTS. Might work, but this is a secondary issue if the other database .EXE's don't work. Likely to be a similar issue with COBOL host-language interface.
5. And the KILLER: 1022 uses an embedded license expiration date that has to be reset by a Software House engineer or with a re-issued distribution tape. "System 1022 contains a built-in expiration date. If you run it after its expiration date, 1022 will type an error message and exit." I had forgotten that small detail -- one of the major nuisances of running a shop that was highly dependent on 1022. Of course, I don't get the message because the program starts with an illegal instruction message, but I would expect that the license date has expired by now. 😊

I don't think there would be much interest in creating and installing a V6.1 TOPS-20 running FORTRAN-20 V10 just to get 1022 running, even if the expiration-date issue could be resolved.

If this suggests anything else I might try, please let me know. I'll continue to look at this to see if there's anything I can do to get it running. 1022 was a great program and historically significant in the research and higher-ed communities.

David

[larsbrinkhoff]

A game historian on Discord asked me about running a game from the Tymshare tapes. Similar to you, he found that the .EXE files wouldn't run on TOPS... 10, I believe it was. I wonder if the Tymcom-X programs use a different format than TOPS-10 or 20, but I don't know.

[hdtodd]

On 1/28/26 8:18 AM, Lars Brinkhoff wrote: *larsbrinkhoff* left a comment (PDP-10/System1022#1) <#1 (comment)> A game historian on Discord asked me about running a game from the Tymshare tapes. Similar to you, he found that the .EXE files wouldn't run on TOPS... 10, I believe it was. I wonder if the Tymcom-X programs use a different format than TOPS-10 or 20, but I don't know.

Lars, I wouldn't be surprised if the Tymshare .EXE formats were different from DEC's standard .EXE, though I really don't know for sure. Several of thos timesharing companies developed their own formats for things (including disk drives!). In the case of 1022, I know that it ran on standard TOPS-20 monitors (we did).  But it used a modified version of PA1050, the program that provided DECSYSTEM-10 UUO compatibility for TOPS-20 programs. I've tried both the standard TOPS-20 V7 PA1050 and the version that came with 1022 on those tapes, and the 1022 .EXE files failed with illegal instruction messages in both cases.  So I'm *guessing* that the Software House PA1050 on those tapes is incompatible with TOPS-20 V7 and that the TOPS-20 PA1050 (which has NOT had Software House's PA1050 patches applied) is incompatible with 1022.  I could (and may) try applying Software House's PA1050 patches to the TOPS-20 V7 PA1050, if the right set of tools is around.  But I doubt that the V6.1 patches will work on the V7 version of PA1050, if the Autopatch system would even try.